From Barriers to Breakthroughs: Women in the Elevator Workforce
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Intro:
Today’s episode brings together the experiences of three women as they reflect on what it means to build a career in a male-dominated trade. Featuring Erin Scott with ATIS, Emerald Kuhns with NAESA International, and Shannon Drezek with the IUEC. They share the challenges they’ve faced, the programs and support systems that made a difference, and the courage it takes to speak up in spaces where women are still underrepresented. They also discuss the progress happening across the industry, from growing female participation to shifting workplace culture, and the barriers that still need to be addressed for the next generation.
Transcript:
Matt Allred (00:00)
So Shannon, do you ever get strange looks when people ask you what you do and you say, I’m an elevator constructor?
Shannon Drezek:
Oh, absolutely. It just blows their mind. They’re confused. They’re elevator constructor or like, you’re not selling elevators? No, no, I’m installing elevators. Thank you very much. And especially with women, they’re just drawn to it. And they’re like, like a celebrity. Can I take a picture with you? You know, you’re so rare. mean, holy cow, you’re working on elevators. You’re a woman, you’re doing this. like.
Yep. I’m a woman. do lots of different things. Thank you for recognizing that, but yeah, I’m just doing my job. But yeah, guess what? This could be you or your daughter, your niece, or your nephew, whoever you want it to be. It’s, it’s just so, so rarefied and almost celebrity status. And I love it, but it gets them talking about it and talking about the trades and, giving them the opportunity that yeah, you can do this yourself too.
Matt Allred:
That’s amazing.
Matt Allred (02:01)
What is it like, you know, being a woman in a male dominated industry, especially, like you say, to be less than 1 % and to, you know, what was, I guess, the most difficult thing about that?
Erin Scott:
For me, it’s how I’ve always known it. So for me, you know, I thought it was normal. That’s how it started, you know, in the military, you know, so, but I also have been fortunate that I
have just had a very strong support network, but there are days that you definitely feel like alone and isolated. But I think the key is finding the people who value you and are there to help build you up versus break you down. And I think the key that has made me who I am is also knowing that sometimes you have to work
a little bit harder to be able to make sure that your voice is heard and not being afraid to speak up and call people out when they don’t value what you’re saying to the same degree as your male counterparts at the table.
Matt Allred:
It’s like, you gotta, you gotta be even stronger to just stand up and say, no, I will be heard.
Erin Scott:
Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, I saw it a lot. Both back in flying, but also.
A lot with even our customer base here, like in the Boston area, like my sales counterparts for the most part were males and we would walk into a business meeting and you know, they would turn to the male, you know, and be like, so can you tell me what’s wrong with my elevator? And I remember one guy’s like, no, dude, I’m just the money guy. Like I don’t even know how an elevator works. Like you have to talk to her. And the facilities manager was like, wait, what? You know?
He couldn’t even fathom like what was being said, you know? So it’s funny, even at this day and age with all the things that we’ve talked about, that like the whole concept of like unconscious bias still exists that when you walk into a room, people just automatically assume that one way or another, you know, ⁓ the woman’s going to be at the sales side, you know, and the male is going to be on the operations side. So it.
just always, we would always get a good laugh. And I was pregnant twice, like while at Otis and you’d waddle in with your big old belly and stuff like that. And people would just be like, seriously? Like, this is the lady that you were talking about that was coming to fix the elevator? And you’re like, yeah, that’s me. So even pregnant, you can still do your job around here these days. ⁓
Like I said, I’ve also been in situations where I’ve just been very blessed with the teams that have been around me, you know, and the people, but, ⁓ and it probably just helps that I do have a stronger personality that does speak up, but not everybody in the industry has been that lucky. And I’ve known really smart women that haven’t felt that supported that have left and that, you know, and I hate to see that, but.
You know.
Matt Allred:
All the more reason then to have that mentorship and that networking group to say, it’s okay to raise your voice. It’s okay to stand up and be heard because your opinion does matter and what you’re seeing, you know, maybe no one else is seeing it. And so, you know, it’s important to let people know.
Erin Scott:
In a lot of those groups, it’s important. Like people think, like it’s a girls club. And it’s really not like most of our membership in those clubs.
you know, was typically 50 % male because it’s about having allyship and it’s about having men in the group too that, know, are willing to say what you’re doing is not right. you know, stop and listen. What she is saying has value at the table just as much as what I say as well. You know, so that allyship sometimes is as important, if not more, as just being a member, you know.
Matt Allred:
Absolutely.
Matt Allred (06:30)
I’m just curious, what are some of the challenges of being a female in a male dominated industry?
Emerald Kuhns:
I’ve been asked that a lot. When I first came in, it was very intimidating, scary. ⁓ But I think it’s getting better over time where you’re seeing more and more women in this industry. We have our own ⁓ group. It’s Women in Motion, where I attend those meetings. so ⁓ it was hard. It’s hard. And it still is.
But it’s getting easier and easier as there’s more and more of us coming in and that’s great.
Matt Allred:
Yeah, yeah. I talked to a lady recently who joined, you know, 15, 20 years ago and she said that there was one particular woman who was kind of like an executive level or had been there a while and was able to just reach out and just kind of build that network. And I’m sure that you see that, you participate in that and I’m sure that helped.
Emerald Kuhns:
We stick together.
We all stick together and bounce ideas off each other.
Shannon Drezek: (07:37)
So in our estimation, in the US and Canada, there’s about 33,000 elevator constructors. And from our best estimate, only approximately 300 ⁓ of those people are females. So we are less than 1%. But I can definitely say it has taken the upward swing in the recruitment efforts that are put on by the National Elevator Industry Education Program, NEIEP, and the union itself to get the word out.
up those numbers. I’ve seen, we’ve probably grown about 40 women in the last three years across the US and that’s huge.
Matt Allred:
What would you say keeps women from being in the trade?
Shannon Drezek:
Seeing the people, doesn’t apply to me necessarily, my situation, but it is actually surprisingly enough childcare. Of course, women are having the children, right? Unless
You can go through surrogacy or IVF, predominantly women are carrying these babies and early childhood development until they’re able to go to school. And even in the situations of single fathers or divorce or things like that, but it is the childcare who the parent, they’ll take the sacrifice of their job and their careers. And it’s so ironic because they could be making top tier benefits, top tier money.
to take care of these families and provide for them and give them whichever direction they want to raise them. But it’s also keeping them from getting those jobs, going through the apprenticeship, the long hours of working construction, because that’s what you’re going to start off in. And it’s finding the early child care to take care of them when they’re not in school. And then, of course, navigating 10 or 12 hour work days. How do we get them early? How do you get to the job and work six to four, six to five?
and out of town and things like that. So it is a big thing that’s come up with our other sisters and just our members that, you know, if they go through the life changes of, you know, planning marriages or divorces, or they’re like, I’m having kids, is this going to mess up my, career, my future, you know, becoming a mechanic or, however they find it. And, many of them, they’re successful families of dual partners of where, you know, the
The wife and the husband are both elevator constructors. mean, I, I know, you know, women that have already retired out and that’s how they met and now their sons are in it. And they’re all just trying to make it work and balance for each other. But if we can open the eyes in the construction industry, union or not that that’s keeping us away from a talented, pool of, of people, men or women to, come to the trades in general.
Matt Allred:
Interesting. So, so on one hand I hear.
that childcare is the issue. On the other hand, I hear that if you, know, as a family or you work together, you know, there are ways to work around that to make it successful. for those who have, it’s good for the family. I’m just saying that to your point, often the childcare, you know, has traditionally landed in the women’s corner. And so there has to be a ways to work.
through that. And so maybe what I’m hearing you say is, yes, this can be an issue. Yes, it can be worked through. And maybe it’s perception as much as anything but just, guess, expanding people’s awareness that no, this can be done and here are some examples of people doing it. ⁓ that’s kind what I’m gathering from what you’re saying.
Shannon Drezek:
Yeah, yeah, definitely. You know, many people have said, is it, you know, the physicality of the work or, the education or the knowledge, right? And I’ll say to that, I mean, you can learn anything with the right teacher, people learn different ways. You never really necessarily know if you are mechanically minded or electrically minded unless you try it. There’s no litmus test really to do that otherwise in our testing procedures. So.
People have said, you know, is that what’s keeping women out or people disinterested in the trade and not doing it? And no, it’s not. I would definitely say it’s, it’s other priorities that are taking them away from choosing these careers. I guess it takes, understanding of the other partner. Like I was able to with my significant other that understood from a construction background that, if I have to go and I have to be out of town, this is what’s going to have to happen. You’re to have to pick up the bit, take care of the things at home.
But ⁓ I think that’s, with anybody, whether you’re working with a doctor that’s on call, you know, ⁓ a first responder that’s going to have to leave in the middle of the night and things like that when we’re taking elevator calls. I think that’s just going to be in any relationship is to find the other person that’s going to understand your work. you know, again, weigh out the balances of that. If your absence for that paycheck is going to be worth what your goals are as a family or as a couple.
Matt Allred:
Yeah, thank you. I mean, what comes to mind is, I think there’s a lot of, you know, tradition, there’s history, there’s stereotypes around who does what jobs. And I know a lot of families where one of the spouses is a nurse and they have interesting shifts and they have, you know, maybe it’s a 12 hour, maybe they’re traveling, maybe they’re, you know, there’s all kinds of challenges to taking care of a family and yet they can all get worked through. yeah, I think it might just be.
people’s awareness that, hey, this is an option. And certainly if someone has those skills, I know that, you know, technical and electrical competence does not run on gender lines, right? It’s just, you know, some guys don’t do it, some do, some women, you it just depends. Just getting in, learning your part really opens up doors to other things that I haven’t seen in other career areas as much, right? To see somebody move from.
Maybe they’re in ops and then now they’re in sales, now they’re inspecting and now they’re leading, now they’re owning, now they’re, you know, there’s just all of opportunities that, that will present themselves as you get in, do a great job, learn your stuff and then, you know, write your own ticket.
Shannon Drezek:
It is, it is. Just like you said, bet on yourself and you can carry your way. Make your name, you make your name and that’s everything in the trades. They’ll hire you, they’ll seek you out.
Matt Allred:
Yep. Absolutely.